By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. I see three possible ways of determining an answer: Options 1 and 2 are very problematic. Our loyalty should be to God alone. 288. Because we are part of the Church and incorporated into Christ, the Holy Spirit, in coming to rest on the Son, comes to rest on us. Bishops may pay money to Pope instead of you, but. It doesnt tell us to argue with them. In this post, we list some of the differences between the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic Churches. It operates as a communion of autocephalous churches, each governed by its bishops via local synods . Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. To be able to do penance and be purified, we need the sustenance which the Church provides in its liturgical life and its sacraments. 2nd Timothy 2:23 Please look to your priest for guidance. You could label yourself non-denominational. And all three of these point towards the Catholic Church. Should I become a Catholic, or Orthodox? The primary function of the ministers is to administer the Sacred Mysteries (Sacraments), which, because they communicate the divine life, assist us in the process of theosis. Ive spoken with numerous Orthodox and Catholic account(s) to which all replied with valid points supporting both churches. Scan this QR code to download the app now. Truth is vitally important, but one must recognise an impasse. The first question implies belief(s), as does the second. The truth is that they detest each other but call it speaking the truth in love. Not necessarily so), and break communion with any bishop that sided with Athens. One option I considered was becoming Eastern Orthodox. Should I join the Roman Catholic or Eastern Orthodox church? Yes, I believe in this. Is it as simple as the priest anointing the new member? Eastern Orthodoxy, official name Orthodox Catholic Church, one of the three major doctrinal and jurisdictional groups of Christianity. They pray for the souls of the departed, which makes sense only if those prayers can help the departed in some way. Archived post. https://mpoweredchristian.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/mpowered-christian-logo-web-320px.jpg. What do you think about attending church and Mass prayers on every Sunday? so anti catholicism started in the early christianity since greeks didnt want to be under Roman rule in any way so starting from 4th century and constantine they paved the road for their own version of christianity that led all other eastern and oriental from the right path. Thank you so much for helping me find God, and may He bless you! Just look for the one tradition you believe to be the most true. i agree with this ^^^. Todays celebration is an invitation extended to both our Churches to the unity of the Cross. That does not ring true. I'm Roman Catholic. Matt. Im doing a report on Eastern Orthodox, so like most other seminarians, Im starting with your posts. Some sort of primacy existed. Imagine all the competing binding and loosing all 30,000+ of them! Be willing to keep changing your mind, as long as you are doing it with the intention to honor God by remaining as close to His Truth as possible. We must be transformed through prayer, sacramental participation and self-discipline. Do you like them? But there is only one absolute truth. 13:17), and if Jesus put one particular minister over the others, it would be understood that he had authority over them. Papa Franky is following suit and really pushing the idea of himself as Bishop of Rome first. This symbolic act already symbolizes an acknowledgement that Saints Peter and Paul founded the See of Rome (as countless early Christian sources attest). This is where Christ comes in. The absence of a pope has led to a kind of magisterial paralysis on the part of the Orthodox, and this concerned me very much as I recognized the need for Christs Church to have a functioning teaching authority capable of settling new theological controversies. The 21 Coptic Martyrs: More Orthodox Saints in the Catholic Church, "There is no salvation outside of the Church", Pope to pope: Let our churches be united by Christs love. John specifically tells us that he did not say this of his own accord, but being high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus should die for the nation (John 11:51). I only wanted to offer here that the 3 options you offered are very Catholic options. is very difficult. Your relationship with God is the most important thing. That means that we (the laity) have the authority to not only forgive anyones sins, but also to retain anyones sins. There are various reasons why you would want to become a part of any of the various traditions within Christianity. Your email address will not be published. It meant that both groups could admit that the pope has a special authority based on his connection to Peter. The Eastern Orthodox Catholic Church (also known as the Orthodox Christian Church or, simply, the Orthodox Church) is the oldest and second largest Christian body in the world. As a BetterHelp affiliate, we may receive compensation from BetterHelp if you purchase products or services through the links provided. Does the importance of having the truth justify it? The Creed is inviolable and cannot be changed. This creates an immediate problem. IN THE BEGINNING GOD CREATED MAN AND WOMAN. Here, "orthodox" means the same as "faithful and accurate." Faith is serious business. thats why the sack of constantinople was triggered anyway. The emphasis on hesychasm and noetic prayer and the direct experience of God distinguishes the East from Western Christianity. 1 Cor. Some are personal preferences, what your family does, etc. First, its fundamentally inconsistent with the ecclesiology proclaimed by either the Orthodox or Catholic Church. Saints, Feasts, and Readings for 06/21/2023, Julian the Martyr of Tarsus; Terentios, Bishop of Iconium; Nikitas the New Martyr of Nisyros. Ive noticed the EO have a tendency to paint their side as Roses while painting Catholicism as a thoroughly corrupted manure pile. Its adherents live mainly in the Balkans, the Middle East, and former Soviet countries. I believe that other extras are seen as too much explanation; they prefer to leave things as mysteries. I think the Immaculate Conception and the details of transubstantiation (i.e. They more or less readily concede the keys of the kingdom passages in the NT, and acknowledge Romes importance in settling early disputes among the patriarchs. The pope remains the Patriarch of the West, and leader of western Catholicism: he just doesnt use that title formally (I wouldnt go so far as to say that hes renounced it it was dropped as one of the official title without comment). Ive heard many Orthodox commend a book by Philip Sherrard called Church, Papacy and Schism: A Theological Enquiry, saying that the arguments contained in this book are what must be addressed by Catholics if they truly want to address the actual objections posed by the Orthodox, and not merely straw man Catholic apologetics. 10:20; John 15:26; Acts 2:33; Gal. Compared to other religions, cults, and heretical offshoots of Christianity Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, and Protestants have much more in common than we do not. Hey Joe, Dan W here. It thus seemed that the Churchs magisterium has the authority to revise creeds of this nature. The early Church certainly understood Christs ministers as having authority over laity (cf. This emphasis came from Leo and Rome to begin with because they wanted to uphold the dignity of the sees with the historic Petrine connection over the innovative claims of Constantinople. I've read a lot from St Paisios and have never come across anything that could be interpreted as supporting contraception. I do think there are some important differences though that are not to be minimized. No, I don't think its true. JavaScript is disabled. The other 13 autocephalous Churches served notice that they were striking neither Constantinople nor Moscow from their diptychs, so they would be remaining in communin, so they had better resolve the matter between them, which was done in a month or so, and Moscow put Constantinople back in its diptychs and resumed communion. There have been more books published since, and much information is available on the Internet (which wasnt commercially available then), but at the time I was limited to a few books on Orthodoxy by Jaroslav Pelikan and Timothy (now Bishop Kallistos) Ware. But is this reason enough for me to belong? We are not Protestants or poor Catholics (abandoned by their leaders) who have to figure things out on our own. Considering the options that you've picked in this quiz, it can be said that you look really impressed by the Catholic religion. What about my Russian neighbor baptized Eastern Orthodox? Both are apostolic in the sense that they both have apostolic succession. Reddit, Inc. 2023. broke off communion. Is Catholicism self-defeating and circular? 28:2930). Have you ever heard of of the massacre of the latins, where thousands of catholics were massacred by byzantine local population just because normans raided southern italy and converted local orthodox greeks into catholics??? Im torn between Catholicism and Orthodoxy. How to Resolve the Orthodox Question(1) Follow your local bishopWith Option 1, if the Orthodox bishops of Australia and New Zealand broke off communion, accusing each other of schism or heresy, the Orthodox believers of those countries would divide along nationalist lines. Under neither option does the Body of Christ get divided because schismatics, heretics, and apostates only leave but can only pretend to still be part of the Church. So for 500 years theyve been fed a steady dose of anti-Catholicism, attacking anything that looks strange to them, and this bias has become so ingrained that the average person will look with utter disdain upon Catholicism. At least not from within the Christian Body. In Western Europe, some sided with Constantinople, some with Moscow, and some refused to take sides, which was the majority position in the Americas. So, if you wish you can convert your religion to Catholicism cause you'll like following their practices and customs. and the Universal Church has nothing to do with popes and the magisterium but it has everything to do with the Faith and the Church instituted by Jesus Himself. Jesus Christ is the Son of God, the second person of the Holy Trinity. Second,Pope Benedict is Patriarch of the West. He then pointed to all the leaders of the Old Testament being directly appointed by God, and makes the claim that it shouldnt be any different in the New Testament. That seems such a peripheral issue to me. In neither Church is the laity left as the final authority on theological disputes. But look at the part Fr. Constantinople was added as a fifth Patriarchate, a controversial move initially opposed by the pope (but eventually accepted). The Orthodox point out that if Rome always had this universal jurisdiction over the entire Christian world then there would have been no need for any Ecumenical Councils. 2. The church has decided it has infallibility to determine doctrine. I would love to see a post that addresses these issues and really gets into the details of the real Orthodox objections to them. Trivia Quiz. Sure, the Orthodox arent quitein full communion with the Catholic Church, but theyre close enough that, in the past, weve celebrated in the same churches. and the only thing you orthodox talk about all the time is bad popes and the filioque clause which was explained by catholic theologians like 1000 times by now. The difference between identifying a person and a belief is at the core of the distinction between the Protestant and Catholic problem. To an Evangelical, Orthodoxy can seem like a way to have the latter without having to accept the former. I want to become a part of a church. the lord never said that all people will be holy in His Church he only said that the gates of hell shall not prevail against His Church. These are points that Ive seen broadly conceded. I recommend learning as much as you can about the history and beliefs of each.I believe they all have a lot of truth. Can I legitimately go to my friend's Greek Orthodox church and receive Communion? The political institutions the apostles were familiar with didnt have people who had figurehead positions. I'm an Eastern Orthodox Who left The Church 4 times back to Rome And them returned. "It's all about the Eucharist," as one Orthodox lady told me. Can you use the examples that you raised and answer some of the questions I raised earlier about Orthodox eclessiology? Catholic Christianity offers the world the fullness of the Christian Faith. However, union with God is not automatic. If the Creed is to be changed, it should be done in union with the East (meaning specifically the Orthodox). Indeed, thats how we got the Nicene Creed: It is a revision done in 381 by one ecumenical council (Constantinople I) of a previous creed written in 325 by another ecumenical council (Nicaea I). Christ says the demons cant come out except with prayer and fasting Any church that does away with fasting is a sorry sorry church. 0 There are various reasons why you would want to become a part of any of the various traditions within Christianity. The Eastern Orthodox also have an issue in the degree to which they display catholicity. The Catholic Church decided to leave orthodoxy in 1054. Answer (1 of 15): The answer is simple. Therefore the democratic election of the pope disproves the papacy and the human appointment of bishops disprove apostolic succession. Ive found only a few articles/blog posts that address these issues from a patristic/first millennium point of view. The answer is easy. Because Orthodoxy is significantly less cohesive than Catholicism, I can't guarantee that a given Orthodox believer will affirm these. This thread is archived New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast 28 As a protestant inquirer, If restricted, is there a permission process outside of RCIA (Rite of Christian Initiation in Adults)? It emerged in my reading that many Orthodox were prepared to make two key concessions regarding the papacy: that Jesus did give Peter a form of primacy over the other apostles (though this was conceived of first among equals role) and that the bishop of Rome is in a special sense the successor of Peter, though other bishops also may in some sense be Peters successors. Sorry for making the 1028378th of one of these posts, but I am really trying to find out the truth, however from the posts I see it's either a 20000 word essay or just listing things out without explaining them, ie "I'm Catholic because of Filique and Peter". What the Orthodox Affirm These are points that I've seen broadly conceded. Harry Potter House Quiz: Which Hogwarts House Do You Belong To? 28:1920), and it is worth noting that the Catholic Church has fulfilled this mandate more effectively than the Orthodox church has. CELEBRATION OF THE LITURGY IN THE SACRAMENTS, 06. There are at least two other modes of selection for ordination that I know of, described in the New Testament: (1) Acts 6:1-6 describes the selection of the first deacons. Estonia, however, belongs to the jurisdiction of Moscow, whose Patriarch at the time, Alexis II of blessed memory, happended to be Estonian bred, born, baptized, ordained, consecrated and speaking. When Pat. I agree with all the teachings of the Orthodox, especially on the fillioque and baptism by immersion as compared to the Catholic views, yet I still feel drawn to the Catholic church. Even recent Orthodox Saints like St Pasios Of MT Athos repproved Contraception, And It seems more And more there's no consensus within Orthodoxy About it. And I believe that God wants us to have both and would have wanted us to have both when He established His Church. I don't know what this festival is about. whatever history are you reading that says the Orthodox patriarchs had a duty to be anti-Catholic??? "This is in line with American mainline religion, [where] everyone is . Matt. There are ACTIONS that the POPE has done which give catholics a bad name, it has to do with HISTORICAL FACTS, not with vaguely being fed doses of anti-Catholicism. Catholics who follow a magisterium and not our own reasoning, or you who feel able to discern for yourself which church is the right one? #1 Christ Is Risen! These guidelines replace the guidelines approved by the Administrative Committee of the NCCB in November 1986. On a subject this far from human experience, my feeble mind could not be relied upon. That isnt humble. I believe there is something beautiful about our unity for God amongst our diversity.All Christians need to remember that our loyalty should not be to our religion. My family barely goes to Church so as of now Im stuck with learning what I can online. Quiz: What Will I Look Like When I'm Older? One practical hurdle was that in the South, where I grew up, there werent many Orthodox around. A little bit about me: I'm a 25 year old of french canadian/Spanish backround. Have you thought about being Protestant? II. Their issue, however, is that Rome changed how it saw itself in and around the 11th and 12th century by claiming a universal jurisdiction over the entire Christian world; in effect, seeing all of Christendom as a kingdom with the Pope as Monarch over it all. It is characterized by its continuity with the apostolic church, its liturgy, and its territorial churches. What you do with your life that glorifies Him is what you should focus on. But honestly, there's good arguments for both sides. Ultimately, though, I recognized that it was not up to me to decide this question; it was up to the Church. I couldnt decide on the one, true faith based on which churches are in the local yellow pages. It has stood for 2000 years. This sacrament of confession is the process of healing and restoring our damaged and wounded fallen nature. that your faith may not fail; and when you have turned again. This still left me to consider whether the Holy Spiritdoesproceed from the Fatherandthe Son. It might seem like a small matter, but it pertains to the inner life of God, and that makes it important. Orthodox do not recognize the pope as having the kind of teaching and governing authority that the Catholic Church claims. These post are at least proof that both sides still care.

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